Phyllida Roberts, head of law conversion at The University of Law, shares her top tips for non-law students preparing for a career in law
Phyllida Roberts studied modern languages as an undergraduate before training as a solicitor. She is now head of law conversion courses at The University of Law, helping the newest generation of non-law graduates make the jump into their legal careers.
Ahead of her appearance on the panel at Legal Cheek‘s upcoming virtual event ‘Why non-law students make great lawyers — with Ashurst, Mishcon de Reya, Reed Smith and ULaw‘ on Tuesday 3 June, Roberts sat down with Legal Cheek Careers to share her advice to non-law students and explain why she thinks they make such great lawyers.
1. Could you describe your career journey and how you got to where you are today?
I was undecided about at career path at 18, despite always being interested in ‘the law’. I studied modern languages as an undergraduate and then as the reality of work approached, I applied to law school but I don’t think there was a ‘lightbulb’ moment — I could easily have chosen a career in teaching! I spent two years at the College of Law in Guildford, first on the conversion course (CPE as it then was) and then on the Legal Practice Course.
Next stop — life as a trainee solicitor in London for 2 years where I remained for 4 years post qualification. Leaving London to practice in Leeds was prompted by personal reasons. I moved into legal education at the College of Law, York — initially as a flexible stop gap ‘to keep my grey cells working’ whilst I had a young family — but I absolutely loved it. 17 years later and I haven’t looked back!
2. What motivated you to work in legal education?
I have always had a ‘teacher’ instinct, I think. I taught in France for two years (one year as part of my undergraduate degree and then one year after I had graduated). I hesitated between a PGCE and a Law conversion and eventually plumped for the latter. I think law and education are very closely linked — advising a client and managing the client relationship is very similar to teaching in that the skill of explaining difficult concepts in a digestible manner and adapting to meet differing student needs are akin to the solicitor/client dynamic.
For me, the transition to legal education felt a very natural step. I really enjoy the ‘nurturing’ side of the role — seeing students join us quite green at the beginning of their studies and then leave us fully confident is very rewarding.
3. What does your role as head of law conversion courses involve?
All sorts — no one day is the same which keeps it challenging and interesting. I suppose my main focus is to help develop and deliver a law conversion course that stretches students but which they will also find absorbing and useful. My role covers most of the basic programme content — liaising with module designers, creating supporting materials in terms of induction, preparing students for assessments, organising exam boards and generally assisting the Programme Director and our national team in providing a solid and engaging academic experience for our students.
I am lucky to work with a great team of people. One of the best parts for me is that I still get to teach and I would definitely say this is one of the best bits. I think it’s important to be authentic and visible in my role and see firsthand what our students are experiencing.
4. What are the benefits of coming into law with a non-law undergraduate degree?
The benefits are huge and I am not just saying that! Students across all different undergraduate backgrounds bring so much to the table – analytical ability and problem solving are vital skills for any lawyer so science, social science and humanities subjects are ideal foundations for a legal career. Conversion students have another string to their bow and their previous experience I think gives them an edge in the workplace — languages helped me but equally a background in science in terms of knowing your client’s industry in areas like patent law can be so beneficial.
5. What are the challenges that non-law students might face during their conversion course and what would be your advice for overcoming them?
As a ‘converter’ I know how daunting it can feel. I didn’t ‘get it’ for a while and there’s always the worry of trying to get through a lot of dense material in a short timeframe.
The style of answering questions on a law conversion course is quite different to the undergraduate experience. We focus on a very practical approach to learning here — our courses are designed to get students thinking like a lawyer from day one with a structured approach to answering questions and this can sometimes be challenging. This is completely normal but we are fortunate to have excellent support teams to assist our students — each student has a dedicated academic coach and we have support via our lecturers, study skills and library teams.
My advice is to be organised and disciplined with your time, ask questions, attend your classes, keep up with your work and make notes as you go along. Make friends and get involved in your campus community (at our physical campuses and our online campus). Most importantly, don’t put too much pressure on yourself — yes, it’s an intense course but ensuring that you rest and have outside activities is important.
6. How do the University of Law’s conversion courses set students up for success on the SQE or bar course?
Whilst a law degree or its equivalent are no longer necessary to practice as a solicitor, we (and most law firms) think it’s crucial. Knowledge of the black letter law is a prerequisite for SQE1 and the conversion component of the PgDL and both MA courses do just that.
The courses are designed with a strong practical focus and teaching and assessments incorporate Single Best Answer Questions (SBAQs). 40% of each module assessment is comprised of SBAQs and this is superb practice for the SRA’s SQE1 exams. Students also benefit from having the law ‘fresh in their minds’; they are not trying to draw on legal knowledge studied when they were undergraduates some time ago. MA Law (SQE1) students also get the benefit of our internal exams after they study the SQE1 preparation course. Again, this gives them vital practice for the external SQE1 exams.
For the Bar, all students must undertake a conversion course if they do not have a law degree — this is the Academic Stage of Training. Again, SBAQs feature in some Bar assessments as well, so our courses set up students for both routes into the profession.
7. How can students make the most of their non-law background in applications for training contracts and pupillages?
I would encourage students to focus on their ‘transferable skills’ — their undergraduate disciplines provide an extra dimension and any work experience is excellent. This doesn’t have to be in law, anytime spent in industry as part of a work placement year or a year studying aboard shows independence, resilience and initiative.
Concentrate on emphasising the fresh perspective and specialised knowledge that your undergraduate degree has given you — be that finance, science or the analytical skills from a humanities degree. We have an award-winning employability team at the University of Law and we are uniquely placed to help students with applications for their chosen route into law.
8. What advice would you give to somebody about to start a law conversion course?
Inform yourself — get as much information as you can on the different conversion courses and what would suit you. Think about how you study best — would part-time study or full-time study work for you? Remember it is a very intense experience even if you opt for a part-time course. Also, think about your preferred mode of study — would you benefit more from attendance at a physical campus or would online study suit you better? Get some work experience if you can — either formally through a vacation scheme or mini pupillage or informally just shadowing a lawyer for the day or sitting in the public gallery at court.
Probably the best advice is to join us at an open day/evening at a physical campus or attend a virtual event for our online campus to get a better feel — just take a look at our website and sign up!
Phyllida Roberts will be speaking at ‘Why non-law students make great lawyers — with Ashurst, Mishcon de Reya, Reed Smith and ULaw’, a virtual student event taking place on Tuesday 3 June. Apply now to attend.
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